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Post by Ironworgen on Jun 19, 2015 14:27:54 GMT -5
Been thinking a lot about the most difficult Iron Challenge.
Tried a Minionless Warlock, which turned out to be less challenging than I expected.
Warrior is tougher, but I am making progress and feel I still have some upside.
Recent numbers show Mage to be the next class for me to attempt.
Then I started thinking about leveling a class without any equipment.
Most of my Druids only used their starting gear and never upgraded any equipment (even unequipped my weapon because it didn't look good with the stylish Worgen caster starter gear I wore).
Even my Minionless Warlock didn't upgrade beyond starter gear until maybe level 20 or so.
Since I have leveled casters with virtually no gear, I was thinking about trying that with a melee class. Casters get by since they do damage based on spells, not weapons, and do a lot of damage from range, not up close.
Melee classes are very dependent on their weapon for doing damage, and armor for protection up close. But what if they didn't have a weapon or armor?
Don't expect a lot of potential from this, but could a naked melee class make it to level 20?! Yes? No?
After the recent demise of Feloci, my Minionless Warlock, I don't have the heart to try Felocii after weeks of playing were just discarded, and it would take weeks of playing just to get back to where I was.
However, a difficult challenge that I expect to end sooner, rather than later, might be worth my time.
Still have my warrior, Fewari, to level, but interested in trying his naked brother. Hmmm...
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Post by iarnaig on Jun 19, 2015 14:39:00 GMT -5
I suspect the answer is a resounding No lol, would be interesting to see how you do though! I remember following Gutrot when he was levelling his naked warrior, he was allowed to die though, and did so many many times... the biggest problem is that, without a weapon, most melee abilities don't work. So when you're already very limited as an ironman, killing off a few more abilities and hitting like a wet noodle with your fists, well, if you made lvl 10 I'd be impressed frankly
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Dranina
Iron Veterans
MotherOwl is Draninas old alias
Posts: 1,063
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Post by Dranina on Jun 19, 2015 16:37:13 GMT -5
I'm doing a dressed up Hunter, levelling her in Festive dress and Blood elf bandt mask Naked does not appeal to me. I have a bow, because a bowless hunter is just no good, and I'm not going to kill her by trying weaponless
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Xaya
Community Moderators
Posts: 1,668
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Post by Xaya on Jun 19, 2015 19:33:51 GMT -5
I admit it could be an interesting experiment (like the 'hardcore', with only dropped gear and no flying). Could be doable on hunter (if you use starting gear, no gear at all seems too suicidal ). But most melee classes need better than starting gear, otherwise you end up doing almost no dammage at all. Could try it at some point, but now I'm mostly trying to get some other classes to 100 (rogues for now, but monk and warlock are also in line for me). Getting to 100 without dying is hard, long and tedious, I'm not really tempted to try something with the odds looking so bad against me...
Xayaforsi lvl 100 pandaren hunter (alive) Wyrmrest Accord Xayatherogue lvl 63 night elf rogue (alive) Wyrmrest Accord
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Post by Ironworgen on Jun 20, 2015 12:29:07 GMT -5
I decided to create a Dwarf Warrior, Fenakwari, since it seems they start with more strength and stamina than other race/class options, which seem vital to the success of this challenge.
Thought about staying with a Worgen, but didn't know if I could get out of the starting area without any gear so I went with a Dwarf.
Since I'm not using any equipment, including a weapon, Heroic Strike is out. Victory Rush is pretty powerful so far when questing at level mobs. I assume that will be less powerful as the levels get higher, and useless when doing low level quests where mobs do not give experience. So that leaves me with just a regular attack.
Got to level 9 with plenty of completed quests to get me to 10 when it happened. Was experiencing bad lag, got disconnected, and came back to a ghost. My first ever DC death! There weren't even any mobs around when I got dropped, which I suppose is thanks to the lag.
Didn't have any trouble getting that far, and all of the quests I was doing were at level. Since I have several starting zones to play with, I could do plenty quests level 10 or below for easier low risk experience, since those quests hadn't presented any problems so far.
I think level 15 is doable, and maybe even level 20, although don't know how much farther than that. May even be possible on a Worgen, which would allow an extra zone of low level quests for more experience, but not sure.
Think I'll stay with a Dwarf for now, but I also think I am going to take maximum advantage of rested bonus, and only quest (kill) while I am rested for maximum experience.
Spent a little over 5 hours getting that far, but I am very slow in my questing, and had at least an hour of afk, so I think I could get back there in 3-4 hours of play time, although I'll need to take time for my rested bonus to build up. Guess thats when I'll play my other characters.
Onto Fenakwarii (Iron-naked-warrior-two).
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Post by marston on Jun 28, 2015 18:39:23 GMT -5
I tried leveling naked warriors a few times. The earliest was back in classic or TBC as an experiment. I am sure other classes, especially pet classes, are easier, but the ones that depend on weapons to attack (Warrior and Rogue, as well as Hunter and Deathknight) are significantly harder. Rogue for example has basically no skills he can use without weapons that actually deal any damage. Hunter has his pet and traps. Warrior had Thunderclap, Victory Rush and Bloodthirst as well as other skills (Battles/Demoralizing Shout, various enrages etc). However, since you basically can't use most of your skills as a warrior your "rotation" is thunderclap and... that's it. At least in current WoW. Without buffs from potions/other players as well as being able to use talents I doubt leveling a naked character is really possible past level 10-20.
I started a naked dwarf in cata I think. I allowed myself to use talent trees and potions (which I crafted myself). The character still exists and he was level 52, just entering swamps of sorrow last time I played him. However, that was back in cata as said (maybe a bit in MoP). Nowadays, many of the core skills for a naked warrior (Thunderclaps and Battleshout being prime examples) are only available much later. They shouts also no longer give a fixed bonus which increases in damage over time but instead now give %, which I think is much weaker without gear.
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Post by Ironworgen on Jun 28, 2015 23:43:55 GMT -5
It did occur to me that since Heroic Strike requires a melee weapon, and you can't use one, there really isn't a need for rage (at least at low levels), so you can always use defensive stance, which actually improves your survival.
Did start Fenakwarii, but I'm trying to milk rested bonus for all its worth, so may take me a while.
Level 10 is a cakewalk, level 15 should be doable, and I think with defensive stance and only leveling with rested bonus that 20 is my goal. Beyond that, we'll see, but thats my current objective.
Also, using only rested bonus will force me to keep my playing short so should avoid burnout while waiting for rested bonus to build up again.
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Post by Ironworgen on Aug 3, 2015 16:31:40 GMT -5
Nakedman Challenge - Which race to play?
I chose Pandas for my Nakedman attempts because of the rested bonus bonus (they get double rested bonus) since I plan to only level while I am rested.
Additionally, Pandas allow for five starting zones, while most other races only allow four (except Worgen and Goblins), which would allow for even more easy experience.
Takes a while to make much progress while waiting for rested bonus to accumulate, so I created five different classes (more on that later). I scoured the internet for the location of an inn on the Wandering Isle, but sadly, there are none, so took about two weeks to rest up before I could get to the end and leave the zone. Then, I realized there is an inn right in the center of the island that you can access very early on, so what took me two weeks or so could probably be done in well under a week, all with rested bonus.
By the time I left the zone, I was level 12, but seem to recall that as a Worgen I was level 14 when I left their starting zone. I did have one snafu when I left a character /afk which resulted in death. I decided to level up a replacement and forget about rested bonus bonus and was only about half a level behind the other characters. If I can get an extra half level every 10-12 levels, that might add up to 2 or 3 extra levels by the time I reach 60 (just assuming that is possible), which sounds like it might make rested bonus bonus worthwhile since it seems an extra level or two when transitioning into Outland might come in handy.
So that is some of my rationale for choosing Panda. Worgen or Goblin would probably provide additional experience due to the extra starting zone, but might be a little slower going due to the loss of the Panda rested bonus bonus.
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Post by Ironworgen on Aug 3, 2015 17:38:05 GMT -5
Nakedman Challenge - Which class to play?
Druid - Most of my prior experience has been with Druid, and always struck me as one of the better (if not the best) class. With healing, stealth, ranged dps, there is less challenge here. Hunter - If anything is easier than Druid, it is Hunter, next. Monk - No personal experience, but there has been proven success. Paladin - Again, no personal experience, but anything with healing, and plate to boot, just feels easier than some others. Rogue - Melee class just seems like it should be difficult, but there has been plenty of proven success. Warlock - Has been some success here, and my personal experience with the lack of difficulty provided by a minionless Warlock has me looking for other challenges.
Death Knight - Even right out of the gate this seems near impossible without armor or a weapon (and no one else thinks they are legitimate anyways) so this is out.
This leaves a few classes so I made five Pandas:
Priest - Not much success for this class so for, but as far as naked goes, seems one of the best. With healing, a shield, ranged dps, and a dot, this was my scout for my other naked pandas. Mage - Ranged dps seems powerful for a naked player. Not much success for normal irons, but not bad so far as naked. Shaman - Much like a mage as far as ranged dps goes. Recently read of Shamans troubles so wanted to see how they compare to other nakeds.
Warrior - Of course I needed to try a naked warrior. Ranged casters seem like they should fare better than melee classes, and with no armor everyone is squishy, so the question is whether bare hand combat can survive as well as spell casters.
Hunter (petless) - Seems crazy, but this is what I really want to play, a naked Hunter without a pet. Even less powerful than a Warrior. This may be the most challenging class option.
All five Pandas made it out of the starting zone without any real issues. Warriors and Hunter did have a couple battles that required some carefulness, but no major hurdles to completing the zone.
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Post by Ironworgen on Aug 3, 2015 18:14:06 GMT -5
In addition to my five Pandas (Priest, Shaman, Mage, Warrior, petless Hunter), I created another Worgen minionless Warlock (Pandas can't be Warlocks), who without the benefit of the Pandas rested bonus bonus, is still floundering away in Gilneas at level 7, but since I had success getting my previous incarnation to level 29, think I'll focus elsewhere.
While I did make a naked Panda Warrior, I still have Dwarven Fenakwarii, who just reached level 18, which has been a cakewalk so far.
Fenakwarii just finished off the four racial starting areas and is moving onto the next tier of zones (Westfall, Dun Morogh, Darkshore, Bloodmyst Isle). Starting the level 10-20 zones at level 18 should allow me to get well into my twenties as a naked Warrior (with no armor, no weapon, or anything). I do expect that when I get to the level 20+ tier of zones (assuming I make it that far) things should get tougher. Don't know if I expect to live until 30.
Felocii, my minionless Warlock (and while not technically naked, only wears starter gear armor for a total of 3 armor), is on the back burner since his predecessor had so much success as virtually naked, level 29.
My Pandas (Femagi, Feprii, Feshai) are also on the back burner since, as far as nakeds go, I expect casters to be easier than melee (Warrior, petless Hunter).
Fenakwariiv (iiv is 3 since you can't have three of the same letters in a row in a name, so iii is out. Hope Fe-pri-i doesn't die, don't know what I'd do for his follower) is also on the back burner since Fenakwarii is still going strong.
While Fenakwarii is still active, I think he will serve as something of a scout for Fenakhuni.
Fenakhuni (petless Hunter) is what I consider to be (right or wrong) the most difficult naked iron class to play. Don't expect him to live as long as Fenakwarii, but should be able to get into the twenties.
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Post by Broken Fox on Aug 3, 2015 18:43:33 GMT -5
Naked Warrior would be infinitely harder than a petless hunter. Naked and petless is actually very doable as long as you're very.. very.. careful. Iron warrior would be like bashing like your face into a cinderblock while surrounded by lava and any false move could cause you to fall in and melt to death
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Post by Ironworgen on Aug 3, 2015 20:39:05 GMT -5
Naked Warrior would be infinitely harder than a petless hunter. Naked and petless is actually very doable as long as you're very.. very.. careful. Iron warrior would be like bashing like your face into a cinderblock while surrounded by lava and any false move could cause you to fall in and melt to death Hmmm ... why would that be? As far as combat goes, a level 12 Hunter does less than a Warrior: | Hunter | Warrior | Damage | 16-17 | 19-20 | Attack Power | 27 | 33 | Attack Speed | 2 | 2 |
As far as abilities, Hunter gets Explosive Trap at 38 for some damage dealing, but before that, nothing. Warrior get Victory Rush which is rather powerful if you kill a mob that gives experience, plus Charge and Taunt, while not doing any damage are useful. So far, through level 12, I haven't noticed any significant differences, but I do expect a petless Naked Iron Hunter to be more of a challenge than a Naked Iron Warrior. We'll see.
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Post by Broken Fox on Aug 4, 2015 2:32:07 GMT -5
Just wait til you try Warrior
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Post by Ironworgen on Aug 4, 2015 8:49:09 GMT -5
Well, I'm sure eventually things will get difficult, but I have already played an Iron Warrior to 27 (death by disconnect) and my current Naked Iron Warrior is 18 with no problems so far.
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Dranina
Iron Veterans
MotherOwl is Draninas old alias
Posts: 1,063
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Post by Dranina on Aug 4, 2015 10:38:18 GMT -5
Nakedman Challenge - Which race to play?I chose Pandas for my Nakedman attempts because of the rested bonus bonus (they get double rested bonus) since I plan to only level while I am rested. Takes a while to make much progress while waiting for rested bonus to accumulate, so I created five different classes (more on that later). I scoured the internet for the location of an inn on the Wandering Isle, but sadly, there are none, so took about two weeks to rest up before I could get to the end and leave the zone. Then, I realized there is an inn right in the center of the island that you can access very early on, so what took me two weeks or so could probably be done in well under a week, all with rested bonus. There sure *is* an inn on the wandering isle. The big temple, just to the rigth when you get in. I always set my HS there.
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